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How did 20 lower-class Jesus followers convert so many people in only 300 years?

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  • #21
    Originally posted by Johnny Bigodes View Post

    Acts 2:41 and 1 Corinthians 16:6
    The claim: About 500 saw Jesus after he was resurrected. 3000 were baptised at Pentecost a few weeks later.
    The proof, according to you, that is claim is true is 1 Corinthians 16:6

    1 Corinthians 16:6 reads, "Perhaps I will stay with you for a while, or even spend the winter, so that you can help me on my journey, wherever I go."

    One of us appears confused. Let's assume it is me and that you want to explain to me how 1 Corinthians 16:6 tells us that "About 500 saw Jesus after he was resurrected. 3000 were baptised at Pentecost a few weeks later."

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    • #22
      Originally posted by Johnny Bigodes View Post
      About 500 saw Jesus after he was resurrected. 3000 were baptised at Pentecost a few weeks later.
      I've heard that claimed. But I haven't heard from those 3500 people, in general. Saying that people saw Jesus isn't the same as people saying they saw Jesus.

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      • #23
        Originally posted by mikeofallbirds View Post

        I've heard that claimed. But I haven't heard from those 3500 people, in general. Saying that people saw Jesus isn't the same as people saying they saw Jesus.
        I think Paul claimed that 500 had seen the resurrected Jesus, but then he added, And I saw him, too.

        We know that Paul didn't see Jesus physically. So I think he was making the same claim for the 500 -- that they saw the risen Jesus spiritually rather than physically.

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        • #24
          Originally posted by Mel View Post

          Ever hear of the St Thomas Christians, a group of Christians who lived around 1 CE in different parts of India?
          GR: Talk about heretics. There is no gospel of Thomas. Fictitious.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by Marte View Post

            That's because it was written by an entirely different person. A lot of the letters attributed to "Paul" were written by other people after Saul of Tarsus (who might not have even been from Tarsus and probably was NOT a Roman citizen) was long gone.

            I recommend Forged: Writing in the Name of God by Bart D. Ehrman for the full story.
            GR: No they weren’t.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by Mel View Post

              I don't believe I've mention how much I enjoy having a person in the forum who shares my dislike for Paul and his teachings. I think Paul is a major reason the true message of Jesus, or whomever was, was for all practical purposes lost. The book of Thomas and the Infancy Gospel of Thomas were tossed to the curve and Paul's teaching that all can eat shellfish were taught in their place. I'd mention Paul's teachings on circumcision but as important as it is, that word attracts trolls, imo.
              GR: They were tossed to the curb for good reason. Jesus inspired Paul to write his epistles under the direction of the Holy Ghost. Why you would follow a doubting Thomas is of a mystery. He never got it. While Paul did and was inspired. It’s how we know about the 3 degrees of glory and baptisms for the dead.
              The Bible has been canonized by our prophets and inspired members. That includes Paul’s writings.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by Grasshopper View Post

                GR: Talk about heretics. There is no gospel of Thomas. Fictitious.
                There is a general consensus among scholars that the Gospel of Thomas – discovered over a half century ago in the Egyptian desert – dates to the very beginnings of the Christian era and may well have taken first form before any of the four traditional canonical Gospels. During the first few decades after its discovery several voices representing established orthodox biases argued that the Gospel of Thomas (abbreviated, GTh) was a late-second or third century Gnostic forgery. Scholars currently involved in Thomas studies now largely reject that view, though such arguments will still be heard from orthodox apologists and are encountered in some of the earlier publications about Thomas.

                Today most students would agree that the Thomas Gospel has opened a new perspective on the first voice of the Christian tradition
                Read more here: http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/nhl_thomas.htm

                Heck, read the Gospel of Thomas here;

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by Grasshopper View Post
                  No they weren’t.
                  Yes, they were. If you'd ever learn something outside the rigid, narroiw, militantly ignorant, I've made up my mind don't confuse me with the facts evangelical world you'd post a lot fewer foolish messages.

                  Forged: Writing in the Name of God. I'm sure your public library has it. Go get it. You do have a library card, right?

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by Mel View Post

                    Ever hear of the St Thomas Christians, a group of Christians who lived around 1 CE in different parts of India?
                    No, I hadn't. Will look them up. I presume you mean 100 CE, since Jesus was only a child in 1 CE, given the standard dating for his life.
                    Metpatpetet מתפתפתת
                    אשרי אדם, מצא חכמה ואדם יפיק תבונה
                    Proverbs 3:13

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by Grasshopper View Post

                      GR: Talk about heretics. There is no gospel of Thomas. Fictitious.
                      Not according to Wikipedia. It is one of the Nag Hammadi gospels, dating from between 150-250 CE. Besides, Mel was not talking about a gospel, but rather a group of Christians called the St. Thomas Christians in India. Looking at the Wikipedia article, it seems likely that while their tradition about their founding goes back to St. Thomas, the actual group was organized somewhat later, probably in the 3rd century.
                      Last edited by Metpatpetet; 02-14-2018, 01:12 AM.
                      Metpatpetet מתפתפתת
                      אשרי אדם, מצא חכמה ואדם יפיק תבונה
                      Proverbs 3:13

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Originally posted by Metpatpetet View Post

                        No, I hadn't. Will look them up. I presume you mean 100 CE, since Jesus was only a child in 1 CE, given the standard dating for his life.
                        You're right. I should have wrote 100 CE.

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                        • #32
                          Originally posted by Grasshopper View Post

                          GR: Talk about heretics. There is no gospel of Thomas. Fictitious.
                          And yet a copy from the 4th century was found.

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                          • #33
                            Mel Sorry, man, it was 1co 15:6, "After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep."

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